Public Service Announcement

[nolly]

When I am crashy and out of cope, do not attempt to argue with me. This will only make matters worse. No matter how irrational I'm being, let me rant it out, then provide gentle suggestions for fixing the problem. Try to do this in a tone that doesn't say "You're wrong, you idiot", because this will only make me more stubborn and cranky. Likely reasons for being crashy are being over-tired and/or underfed. Unexpected changes in plans can eat cope when I'm already low, particularly since low cope makes decision making especially difficult.

Comments

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

Is there ever a time when it IS okay to argue with a "you're wrong, you idiot" tone? I mean, this PSA shouldn't be necessary at any time, I'm thinking. People should not have to gauge my mood to tell if it's an okay time to be an asshole to me. They should just assume it's never an okay time to be an asshole to me.

[jkrissw.livejournal.com]

Good observation.

[redbird]

I suspect nolly is asking for extra slack when her own tone isn't what she'd normally want it to be: if I'm being irrational and ranting, it's entirely likely that that will prompt someone else to respond sharply.

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

I just don't see that as something special to Nolly -- when people are ranting, I think it's *always* a good idea to either back off or give them some ranting space.

[nolly.livejournal.com]

This is probably true, and my post is not so much "I want special treatment" as "I can only speak for myself".

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

And thinking about it some more, the people who are likely to get mean when Nolly is ranting are the people least likely to listen to this PSA.

(I should say explicitly that I do get the impulse to ask people to be extra-nice to me when I'm feeling irrational, but I don't think it's reasonable to expect that they will remember to do so in an emotional situation, so I'm more comfortable modifying *my* interactions and having few expectations about theirs, if that makes sense.)

[nolly.livejournal.com]

Not really OK, but I can handle it better at some times than others. While the individual who prompted this post is probably not reading, others who witnessed the interaction are.

[pir-anha.livejournal.com]

ah, i am reading this after your own post, *heh*. see, i knew there was a disconnect somewhere.

i think what nolly doesn't want is to be lectured in a fannish manner. that can come across as "you're wrong, you idiot", and i can think of some people who should in general modify their tone so they sound less like that. but i also know that in certain moods even a mild form of it grates badly on my nerves, while i am perfectly ok with it in most moods -- just not when i am out of cope.

and i don't agree that it's *always* a good idea to give ranting people space. sometimes they should be stopped, if they're about to do damage. why should it be ok for me to be a mean SOB, but somebody else can't tell me off for it? (i know this is an edge condition and not true for many rants -- generally i agree with you.)

[nolly.livejournal.com]

What I want is, when I'm out of sorts because I'm tired and hungry and have suddenly discovered that a meeting venue has changed from a location where I am familiar with the menu and can order with little effort even when tired and hungry to one I'm not familiar with and have had trouble finding acceptable food at, to not be belligerantly told "There is too food here! and they have all sorts of fruit juice, so you're wrong about not having anything cld and uncaffeinated, too!" when I'm in crash-rant mode. Because it just isn't helpful to get that kind of smackdown when the real problem is I'm scraping the bottom of the cope barrel.

[pir-anha.livejournal.com]

well, there i'm with serene -- i think that tone is actually always rude, even if you weren't tired and hungry. one can convey the message that somebody hasn't seen the relevant menu options by pointing out where they are, without the "you're wrong!" accusation.

was this the organizer of the outing? zie sounds ... defensive.

[nolly.livejournal.com]

No. I don't know what the individual's involvement in the change of venuw was, because I was arriving late (which is why the change was a surprise -- the usual location was judged unacceptable for various reasons, and no one called me; I arrived at the original location, found no one, and called someone I knew was planning to attend to see if they're broken early or what.)

[americanstd.livejournal.com]

These are the times when I use a megaphone... is this wrong?

out of cope

[trema-slo.livejournal.com]

This is a great discussion to have. I agree it's not just applicable to Nolly. This viewpoint has widespread application in relationships. Therefore, great.

[ellienihon.livejournal.com]

It was obvious to me, non-master of social cues, that you were pretty exhausted. I hope that my tone did not come across in the belligerent way; I was concerned and hoped to point out unnoticed options.

[nolly.livejournal.com]

No, you were fine; the problem conversation was very early (you mught've been inside getting you own food), and, in combination with everything else, had pushed me too far already, triggering "if I go try and get food either i'll succeed and create an opening for 'i told you so' or i'll fail, and be more frustrated than I already am; either way I lose" (only not so rational; this is retrospective analysis of my mindset).